Max Miller

CLEVELAND, Ohio - Congressman Max Miller could become the subject of a House ethics investigation, the kind of scrutiny that can cast a shadow over a lawmaker regardless of how it ends. But are voters in the Trump era too desensitized by scandal to care?

We’re talking about the case and its broader implications on Today in Ohio.

Listen online here.

Editor Chris Quinn hosts our daily half-hour news podcast, with editorial board member Lisa Garvin, impact editor Leila Atassi and content director Laura Johnston.

You’ve been sending Chris lots of thoughts and suggestions on our from-the-newsroom text account, in which he shares what we’re thinking about at cleveland.com. You can sign up here: https://joinsubtext.com/chrisquinn.

Here’s what we’re asking about today:

The allegations against Congressman Max Miller have now reached beyond his personal life and the campaign trail and into the halls of Congress. What’s happening now?

Anthony Fauci’s showdown with Senate Republicans didn’t end with this week’s contentious hearing. Sen. Bernie Moreno now says Fauci belongs in jail. Is that actually a possibility?

If you’ve been hoping your electric bill would come back down anytime soon, you may be in for a long wait. Why are experts now saying high prices could last until 2030?

The surveillance video is absolutely staggering. How powerful was the Canton house explosion that injured two people Thursday morning?

While investigators work to determine what caused that Canton explosion, another story has people asking a broader question: Why do we keep seeing gas line strikes across Northeast Ohio?

How much failure are we supposed to tolerate from the companies that provide the most basic services we depend on every day? Lakewood thinks it’s reached its limit with FirstEnergy. What’s happening?

One of the best investments we can make is helping people improve their own lives. So why is Cuyahoga County about to turn hundreds of adults away from a program that does exactly that?

A Cleveland activist who was cleared of felony charges is now making explosive allegations against the police detective who investigated him. What’s this lawsuit about?

East Cleveland’s mayor says people have gotten the wrong impression about her city’s police department. What rumors is she trying to put to rest?

More Today in Ohio

The paint is barely dry on Cuyahoga’s recently expanded convention center -- and they want to expand it again?

‘Absolutely terrifying.’ This Ohio Supreme Court case could gut your right to challenge City Hall on just about anything

‘A performance for his lord and master’: The politics behind Sen. Bernie Moreno’s obscenity-laced Fauci tirade

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Read a transcript of today’s episode here. (Note that the transcript is automatically generated and likely contains typos and misspellings.)

Leila (00:03.772)

For years we’ve been treating higher electric bills like a temporary pain. But what if they’re not temporary at all? A little later in the podcast today, we’ll be talking about new warnings that Ohioans could be paying elevated rates for years to come, why ordinary customers are subsidizing big tech’s expansion, and what can be done about it. You’re listening to Today in Ohio, the news podcast from Cleveland.com and The Plane Dealer. I’m Layla Atasi, filling in for Chris Quinn, who returns Monday from his well-deserved vacation.

I’m joined by Laura Johnston, Courtney Astolfi, and Lisa Garvin. So let’s start with some interesting news from Washington. The allegations against Ohio’s Congressman Max Miller have now reached beyond his personal life and the campaign trail and into the halls of Congress. Laura, tell us what’s happening now.

Laura\ (00:52.783)

Well, the Democratic Women’s Caucus is calling on the House Committee on Ethics to swiftly and thoroughly investigate all the allegations, the domestic violence, the child abuse claims that have been leveled by Miller’s ex-wife, Emily Moreno, who, of course, just happens to be the daughter of a US senator. They say they are deeply disturbing and can Congress cannot ignore him. US Representative Amelia Sykes of Akron says allegations of violence against women and children have to be met with the utmost seriousness.

They even got a Republican, South Carolina Republican representative Nancy Mays to say that those allegations must be investigated. And if true, he should resign immediately. And Chantel Brown, obviously it also from Northeast Ohio, is calling them serious and deeply disturbing. So Miller’s spokeswoman is rejecting the calls for probe. She says, look, this has been investigated. Child Protective Service has been involved. There’s no basis to the claims, and it’s a

false reality. The narrative has gone on long enough. But you point to, we talked about it multiple times on this podcast about his former girlfriend also had allegations of abuse. And this is a person that represents us in Congress. Like these should be taken seriously.

Leila (02:08.528)

So, Laura, you know, we we’ve obviously seen members of Congress survive ethics investigations and criminal indictments and all sorts of scandals in in recent years. I mean, look at Donald Trump for heaven’s sake. Impeached twice, now running his scams on the American public brazenly out in the open. Nobody seems to care. Politicians seem kind of impervious to scandal. Does an ethics investigation still carry any real political weight or has it become another?

Laura\ (02:13.295)

Mm-hmm.

Laura\ (02:16.867)

Yes.

Laura\ (02:20.931)

Right.

Leila (02:36.21)

partisan fight. I mean, how do you think voters view something like this?

Laura\ (02:40.047)

That’s really good question. And Miller is a Trump acolyte, right? So he’s kind of in that protective wing. But this isn’t this is up to the voters, right? They get to decide because Miller is up for a re-election in the fall. He’s running against Brian Poindexter, a Democrat. And so the more smoke there is around these, the more airtime it gets, the more people realize it and take that into their consideration when they vote. So

I don’t think anything is gonna come out of this congressional allegation. There is no proof that he abused women, right? And I mean, we I I I still cannot believe it’s hard for me that in twenty sixteen Donald Trump said what he said about women and still got elected. That I thought that was the end of his campaign right there. And look at we are ten years later and it’s just been downhill since then.

Leila (03:22.234)

right.

Leila (03:30.339)

Right. I mean that ho please, Lisa.

Lisa (03:30.549)

You know No, I was just gonna say I feel like that Miller would have been able to s continue to kind of fly under the radar nationally on this, but I think that with, you know, his his wife’s father, Bernie Moreno, I think you know, and his you know, his national attention for his tirade, you know, I think that that brought the attention to Miller. I it seemed like nobody cared about him until a couple of days ago.

Laura\ (03:45.256)

huh.

Leila (03:56.999)

Mm.

Laura\ (03:57.232)

But Miller also fanned the Flames. He’s the one who filed a defamation suit against his ex-wife. Like, if you don’t want attention, you don’t bring more lawsuits. And then his ex-girlfriend, Stephanie Grisham, who worked with him in the Trump White House, filed another claim saying, Hey, he’s defaming me by bringing me into this current suit. So, like, if you don’t want attention, just stop talking.

Lisa (03:59.935)

True.

Leila (04:06.268)

Good point.

Leila (04:17.072)

Right.

Right, right. You mentioned Donald Trump and and you know, the Access Hollywood tapes, right? We thought we thought that was the end of him and it was still just the beginning. But that was that was pre the Me Too movement, right? Right, wasn’t it? Was it? I think it’s on the cusp of it. Okay. Now I don’t know if Me Too movement has had any real staying power. I thought it would, but you know, I feel like we blew right through it, unfortunately. But

Laura\ (04:25.187)

Yeah, still blows my brain.

Laura\ (04:35.061)

Me too. I think I think it helped incite me too, right?

Lisa (04:38.485)

It was right on the cusp. Mm-hmm.

Laura\ (04:47.288)

Agreed.

Leila (04:48.964)

In today’s day and age, do you think that the fact that that these allegations against Max Miller deal with violence against women, does that make any difference when it comes to h the way scandals stick to politicians or not?

Laura\ (05:02.877)

You know what makes a difference here is that this was his wife. And I think a lot of the other allegations people are able to wrongly, I believe, but dismiss them as other women, right? And they have an axe to grind. This is his wife at the time and his daughter, his baby daughter. And so I think that puts it in a slightly different category because anyone who values family and all Republicans say they do should that should matter to them. But

Leila (05:06.202)

Mm.

Leila (05:12.242)

Mm.

Laura\ (05:29.101)

I agree with you, Layla, that we kind of blew past this. And so we’ll we’ll see. But the thing is, this isn’t a totally Republican area. I am in this district. Are you in this district in Bay? Yes, probably. Yeah. And exactly. So and those are blue areas. They have been blue for the last at least eight years. So they’re this is not like, we’re all Trump all the time. And there’s something called the Sabato’s crystal ball that

Leila (05:41.495)

yeah, yeah. I live in Bay.

Laura\ (05:56.506)

foresees, you know, makes predictions about elections. And it went from likely Republican to lean’s Republican lately. So this could be changing enough minds in a district that is not, you know, pure blood red.

Leila (06:11.442)

Well, let’s see what his his opponent can do with all of this. you’re listening to today in Ohio. Anthony Fauci’s showdown with Senate Republicans didn’t end with this week’s contentious hearing. Senator Bernie Moreno now says Fauci belongs in jail. Lisa, is that actually a possibility?

Lisa (06:31.429)

Yes, but it’s kind of a long drawn-out process to get there and it’s not always successful. So yeah, during these hearings at the Senate Homeland Security and Government Affairs Committee, Bernie Moreno asked the committee to find Dr. Anthony Fauci in contempt of Congress for refusing to answer questions. He said, This guy’s got to be held accountable. People paid a price, he needs to pay a price, and that means jail.

And he pointed out that Fauci wouldn’t even answer normal questions like what day is it or what is the color of your tie? And he says, well, that’s the exact definition of contempt. And he said, what socialist democrats fantasize about is controlling people and Fauci showed them how to do it. And then he he didn’t curse this time, but he did call Dr. Fauci a depraved SOB. Now, the first step to a contempt is a committee vote.

Then if the committee approves, it moves on to the full Senate where the majority vote is required to adopt and certify it to the U.S. attorney for the District of Columbia. If the Department of Justice prosecutes or convicts, that could mean up to $100,000 in fines and up and one to twelve months in prison. But contempt votes don’t always result in prosecution and Merrick Garland, I think they used as an example.

Leila (07:47.983)

Okay. Lisa. I’m I’m about to haul off on this. I I keep reading these stories and waiting for the smoking gun. Every time Congress comes at Fauci, I’m thinking, okay, here’s where they’re going to reveal the evidence that he knew the virus wasn’t dangerous or that he knowingly misled the public or that there was some grand deception behind what

Lisa (07:52.754)

Ha ha ha.

Lisa (07:59.004)

Mm-hmm.

Leila (08:12.518)

How he was managing this crisis, but that’s never ever what emerges. Instead, we’re still just arguing over decisions that were made amid these extraordinary uncertainty in early 2020. And they are threatening to throw him in jail now for the guidance he provided Americans under great duress, essentially. People obviously can absolutely debate whether schools stayed closed too long or whether masking recommendations changed too often or whether some restrictions ultimately caused more harm than good.

Those are fair debates, but those are very different that from accusing someone of intentionally deceiving the country. And Bernie Moreno with his attacks on Fauci this week is a total disgrace to the state of Ohio. I mean, like you said yesterday, Lisa, performing for his lord and master Donald Trump, that was those were your words. Couldn’t have said it better myself, instead of doing any real work at all in behalf of his constituents. And I can’t.

Lisa (08:59.317)

Yes.

Lisa (09:05.076)

Mm-hmm.

Leila (09:11.876)

wait until he gets voted out of office and recedes back into the world of car sales because this is this is the the the pinnacle of of his his Lisa, do you think we will ever stop relitigating COVID or has this become one of those defining political fault lines that’s going to stay with us for a generation?

Lisa (09:16.145)

Right.

Lisa (09:30.921)

Well, it’s another way of deflecting, you know, because, you know, they just talked about getting rid of Part D for Medicare. So every time there’s bad news, they just, you know, do some performance art, you know, and and the only thing that all the right wing news outlets could seize on was his diary and how he was saying, you know, I feel so popular now and you know, they’re saying I’m really sexy and all this stuff and it was like, That’s all you got.

Leila (09:42.225)

Right.

Leila (09:56.583)

I know, the diary was so tame. There was nothing even in there that was that was that interesting. I mean, it’s just some some guy’s musings about the moment. I mean, it’s really, really astounding. I think if Congress wants to learn lessons from COVID, should the focus be on assigning blame for the last pandemic or making sure we’re better prepared for the next one? There’s been no attention on that, right?

Lisa (09:58.847)

Mm-hmm.

Lisa (10:05.899)

Mm-hmm.

Lisa (10:18.549)

Yeah. Right, right. And here we have a cyclosporiasis outbreak that’s not really being contained or tracked.

Leila (10:24.126)

that’s right. And actually caused by the failings of this administration you’re listening to today in Ohio. If you’ve been hoping your electric bill would come back down anytime soon, you may be in for a long wait. Why are experts now saying high prices could last until twenty thirty, Courtney?

Courtney (10:45.304)

Well, the reason here, according to consumer advocates, is not just how much electricity folks are using. It’s the cost of producing electricity and moving it across the regional grid. And there’s a data center tie-in here, so hang tight. Consumers for a better grid analysis, this consumer advocacy group, they found that wholesale generation and transmission costs made up about sixty-eight percent of the average Ohio electric bill last year.

Those costs have absolutely surged as the region tries to build enough new power plants to keep up with booming demand from data centers. So Clara Summers, she leads the group’s campaign, put this bluntly for us. Our bills would be nowhere near as high were it not for data centers. And PGM’s independent market monitor, PGM’s the grid that serves Ohio and neighboring states. PGM itself monitors.

PGM itself estimated data center demand has added nearly thirty billion dollars to wholesale electricity costs just since twenty twenty-four. So that’s nearly half of the capacity costs that have been charged during that time. You can trace it back to that demand from data centers. PJM like knows it needs to do something about this, right? It says it’s trying to move faster, and its board wants federal approval for emergency changes aimed at bringing

new power plants online sooner and making large electricity users like data centers cover more of the costs. One of PJM’s kind of ideas here is to do a one time auction this fall to attract companies willing to build new power plants to get more online, right? With contracts lasting up to 15 years. And these longer contracts could make it easier for developers to borrow money and get this stuff moving.

Leila (12:36.924)

Courtney, I I think the most depressing part of this story is that we’ve we’ve all kind of thought of these electric bills like as a temporary spike, but the experts are saying this could last through the end of the decade. And this is really the fault of Governor Mike DeWine and his former lieutenant governor, who’s now the senator, John Husted, who invited these colossal data centers to our state to provide our communities no direct benefits and to just guzzle the energy from the grid and spike our energy bills for years to come. And

You know, congratulations, boys. If there were still people who were considering a move to Ohio despite our defunding of public education or the undermining of free thought and higher education, th they’ll change their mind once they realize we’re the data center capital of the country and and because of that our electric bills are sky high for the rest of the decade at least. Am I am I overstating this, Courtney, or is this is just just our new normal here in Ohio?

Courtney (13:35.496)

It by all accounts, that’s what it looks like, Layla. I mean, these things have been in motion for the past two years, but it doesn’t mean even if we were to drastically change our data center policy now, that we can be done with this. I mean, th this is this has set a long term a longer term kind of trend in motion. I don’t know how you unpeel it quickly. It doesn’t look like you can unpeel it quickly. But I I guess on on the good side here is PJM is catching up with this.

consumer outrage over these crazy bills. I mean, I guess some of our hope can be placed in PJM’s hands if they can usher some of these changes through. They’re kind of responding to this in a couple other ways as well. I mean, they specifically are saying they want big users like data centers to make their own deals with power plant developers. And that would, you know, allow it so everyone else isn’t absorbing the cost of this new demand. PJM’s also looking at rolling out a registry

Leila (14:07.687)

Yeah.

Courtney (14:33.218)

So grid operators can better track where that demand is growing. You know, the advocates we talked to applauded these changes, but they don’t think it’s gonna solve all of our problems here and that’s gonna trickle downhill and and have impacts on affordability. But then interestingly, we’ve got this other element at play, a forced shakeup at PJM could be on the way because federal regulators are trying to force changes there, you know, around this whole whole mess of an issue on on generation and and the costs.

That those force changes from DC could come by the end of the month potentially. So we’ve got to keep taps on this.

Leila (15:09.98)

So I just w want to bring the discussion to the suggestion that was made in our recent editorial that was written by our community of readers. And it was a plan that was also then echoed by Amy Acton on the campaign trail. And it’s the simple idea that if data centers are driving the need for billions of dollars in new generation and transmission, then the data centers, not ordinary Ohio ratepayers, should bear those costs. And that just strikes me as such common sense.

If you’re creating the demand, you should be paying for the infrastructure required to serve that demand. And I really can’t think of a much fairer way to approach it. I Courtney, do you agree that or or or are you closer to the side of, you know, maybe banning data centers that exceed a certain threshold?

Courtney (15:55.01)

You know, I I I don’t wanna be closed off to reality. There is going to be a need for this in the future. But I think step one, of course, has to be putting some guardrails on this, putting some limits on it. And I am heartened by the fact that, you know, people have been on this in Ohio for a while now, but it seems like it’s starting to catch on wider. Like if PJM is talking about, hey, we really need to shake this up. I

Leila (16:04.806)

Right.

Courtney (16:20.524)

Maybe the powers that be are starting to catch on to the outrage that’s already been bubbling amongst Ohio’s populace for a few years now.

Leila (16:28.146)

Yeah. You’re listening to today in Ohio. The surveillance video is absolutely staggering. How powerful was the Canton House explosion that injured two people Thursday morning, Laura?

Laura\ (16:39.855)

This is incredible video that c came from a surveillance camera a few doors down. It’s just a fireball that blows repeatedly like fireworks and then it’s all engulfed. It’s shocking no one died in this. And I I’m I mean, somebody was thrown a thousand feet from the explosion. That’s where the second occupant was. So I guess they probably weren’t thrown maybe that far, but that’s where they found him. So firefighters arrived. They found one person in the street.

That was h they were thrown from the house and severe burns, traumatic injuries, taken to the hospital. Burns over eighty percent of their body. And they’re going to Akron Children’s, which is a very special burn unit. So they do excellent work there. But we don’t know the cause and you have to I mean, just as a con you know, a consumer of news, you’re like, what is going on here?

Leila (17:32.869)

Right. I mean, I feel like if this had happened, you know, a year ago, it we we usually kind of chalk this up as just a terrible accident or a one-off, but this is the second explosion in our area of the summer, right? I mean, two two in a month and a half, I think. It it just feels unprecedented. It’s it’s probably time our local leaders investigate this pattern. I mean, whether we don’t really know what caused both of these explosions completely. There’s suspicion, but

Laura\ (17:45.527)

Right.

Leila (18:01.052)

Whether it’s a contractor striking a gas line or a neighborhood evacuation or now this devastating explosion, you really have to wonder whether we’re seeing the warning signs of a broader problem with aging infrastructure or the excavation practices or both. Are we kind of reaching the point? Yeah. I mean, we should really be stepping back and asking why, why are these happening in rapid succession? What is going on, right?

Laura\ (18:12.727)

Mm-hmm.

Right. It’s so weird.

Laura\ (18:25.089)

Yeah, and how come it hasn’t happened before? I mean, I do remember house explosions in the past, but not several in one summer. And it’s been years. And, you know, they have the rules about digging. You’d think that the people who do that are expert and understand what’s going on. But I I’m shocked no one has died. And at this point, if this is can continue, that’s that part is not gonna continue. You know, someone’s gonna be I mean, eighty percent of your body covered in burns, thrown from a house because of a fireball.

Leila (18:49.03)

Right.

Laura\ (18:54.925)

Like that’s unimaginable.

Leila (18:59.3)

And the kind of brings us to our next topic in our discussion, Lisa. While investigators work to determine what caused that Canton explosion, another story has people asking the broader question of why do we keep seeing gas line strikes across northeast Ohio? What do we know?

Lisa (19:15.749)

And there’ve been ones that have not resulted in an explosion. There are quite a few, as a matter of fact. So there were three gas line breaks that occurred in just the last three weeks in Orange Village. And that includes this Wednesday and Thursday at the Miles Road Waterline Project between Brainerd and Harper Roads. So the Wednesday leak, they issued a shelter in place. And I don’t know if it was a leak, it was a break. But they altered issued a shelter in place and drivers were urged to avoid the area. But when they

Traced it, they found that this is a legacy gas line. It’s no longer at use. It used to fuel a shopping center, but no more. But they had to pause construction, and then there’s going to be a meeting with the the water line project people, the officials from Orange Village and Solon, and also utility companies, so they can review the safety procedures, figure out what the cause of this line damage was, and what corrective measures they make.

Now and also it in Summit County, just from August 2025 to April of this year, there were six excavation related gas line strikes in Summit County. Now you have to call 811 before you dig. 811 spokesman Jamie Gillen says, you know, a lot of these incidents, some people just don’t call. But he says some incidents are due to aging infrastructure. He says there are lots of lines and pipes underground. We’ve been putting them underground for 200 years.

And he says, you know, the records tend to be outdated or inaccurate, or there are unmarked private utilities out there that are not marked.

Leila (20:46.482)

So we seem to be in the middle of this enormous infrastructure boom with roads and utilities and fiber and water lines and private development, all of it. Every one of those projects starts with someone putting a shovel in the ground. Why is the call before you dig hotline failing us here? That’s supposed to be the fail-safe. I mean, are they just not calling? Or does that hotline rely on utility maps that might be outdated to locate the utility lines instead of some kind of

Lisa (21:00.778)

Mm-hmm.

Leila (21:14.674)

ground penetrating radar technology to accurately locate the lines. I’m I am just baffled by this. And I I can’t understand why there hasn’t been some kind of, you know, commission put together to examine and p and connect the dots.

Lisa (21:29.355)

Well, it’s quite an exhaustive process because apparently you know, the local utilities are contacted after you call eight one one, local utilities are contacted to go out and mark their lines. So, you know, it’s kind of the onus is kind of on the utilities to find them. But I y you’re right. We’ve had a lot of new development, a lot of road improvements and everything, and so they’re digging, you know, where the these lines exist.

Leila (21:54.513)

Let’s let’s hope that we get through the summer without another catastrophe like this. You’re listening to today in Ohio. How much failure are we supposed to tolerate from the companies that provide the most basic services we depend on every day? Lakewood thinks it’s reached its limit with first energy. Courtney, what’s happening?

Courtney (22:13.418)

Yeah, Lakewood residents are putting numbers and personal storing stories behind their anger over these repeated first energy outages they’ve been dealing with in recent months. So Councilman Tom Bullock sent nearly 300 resident survey responses to state utility regulators, saying they should be considered as PUCO ways whether to reopen its investigation into First Energy’s reliability. Bullock was sharing with the PUCO this.

300 person survey they took in Lakewood that really set out to detail the the effects on the ground of what these outages are doing to folks. Residents here in this survey described outages between May and July, cost them food, wages, medical stability, peace of mind. They found that residents reported 368 outages. The average outage lasted 12 hours. Some lasted as long as 48 hours. And about two-thirds of folks who responded to this

Said they lost food, more than a third said they lost work hours, wages, or customers because of these.

Leila (23:18.882)

So this is was really striking because it it wasn’t just people kind of complaining about, you know, their melted ice cream or anything like that when the power went out. They’re they’re talking about, you know, people who couldn’t power oxygen concentrators or CPAP machines and thousands of dollars in medications that were at risk because of these power outages. That’s that becomes a a public health problem. Do you think that that changes the way regulators ought to look at these cases?

Courtney (23:46.488)

Well, it it sure should. I I know the medical equipment is part of the conversation when we talk about outages. You know, that’s the first thing that kind of raises rises to the top and it seems serious. It should absolutely be considered here. Layla, you mentioned i the number of folks in that survey who talked about the medical difficulties they were facing, about twenty-eight percent of those respondents. So these aren’t a few folks here and there. This is

A lot of people who rely on ventilators or other types of medical equipment. And you talked about thousands of dollars. One one resident who’s, you know, got, you know, extensive medical issues reported trying to protect an eighty thousand dollar monthly medication supply during a prolonged outage. And it that just puts it in stark terms. No one’s buying $80,000 in meds because they may or may not need it. They need that stuff. They need to protect it. And

These things throw all that into jeopardy.

Leila (24:44.06)

You’re listening to today in Ohio. One of the best investments we can make is helping people improve their own lives. So why is Kyoga County about to turn hundreds of adults away from a program that does exactly that? Laura, what’s this about?

Laura\ (24:58.879)

Well, like everything else, it comes down to money, right? And this is federal funding cuts that are cuts that are forcing the Kayaca County Public Library to scale back what’s called the Aspire Adult Education Program. And you can’t blame Trump for this because actually the cuts were before his time. We just didn’t know about them because there was extra money and it was able to continue. So there were nine hundred students last year in these Aspire programs, helped

Adults improve English language skills, become US citizens, gain workforce credentials, and earn their GED. And that’s where this is really important in the Cuyoga County jail. And because of cuts, we’re going to be reduced capacity about a third this year. So that’s 300 slots or down to 600. And it could be more coming. What’s really important about this is what you said, like improving their lives. And it might even have outsized importance in the jail because it gives people more hope.

And it gives them something to come out of the jail with and have a better future.

Leila (26:02.512)

I feel like cutting spending is kind of the hallmark of this federal government right now. we hear a lot about that. But this is one of those stories that makes you wonder what is the cost of those cuts. If someone can’t get a GED, can’t learn English, can’t get job training, or can’t qualify for a better job, we’re we might be saving money today through these cuts, but we are creating bigger problems tomorrow.

Laura\ (26:16.739)

Mm-hmm.

Leila (26:32.312)

And it strikes me that this is probably one of the highest return investments government makes. And you’re helping someone become employable instead of dependent. And then helping someone become a citizen or helping someone leave jail with a diploma instead of nothing. How how do we start having that conversation instead of just looking at the line item that got cut?

Laura\ (26:37.199)

Mm-hmm.

Laura\ (26:46.809)

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Laura\ (26:56.813)

That’s a really good question. And I think you can apply it to a lot of things, like like lead poisoning, right? Like if we could clean up all the lead, we’d be saving ourselves a whole lot of money later. And childcare, you know, it you put in these investments in the beginning and the payoff comes years later, but it’s it’s fivefold or sevenfold. And we don’t know the exact number on this program, but you’ve got to think it would really help the whole community, not just these individuals.

Leila (27:02.545)

Right.

Leila (27:23.058)

Right. And I think that’s unfortunately we’re just a very selfish society. And so we have to put it in terms of this is what’s in it for you. A stronger society is better for you. And maybe that’s the story that has to get told. It’s it’s just really depressing.

Laura\ (27:41.144)

And it what is really depressing is these are federal cuts, right? And so we were able to keep going for a couple of years with state money and reserves. But you know, if they want to continue this money, they’re gonna go to the locals. It’s gonna be Chris Ronain type, you know, leaders handing out their, you know, holding out their hands and saying, We need this, it’s good for the community. And it is good for the community, but it shouldn’t just be another tax on us. You know, health and human services are gonna go up for it again. The Board of Development Div Disabilities, these all work together and they’re

Probably all good programs, but it just should not be just keep pounding at people. And I think you’re right, the federal government is simply looking at line items, whether they’re looking at selling the federal building downtown or just cutting workforce. I mean, it’s just getting it off the books without even looking at what it does.

Leila (28:28.838)

you’re listening to today in Ohio. A Cleveland activist who was cleared of felony charges is now making explosive allegations against the police detective who investigated him. Lisa, what’s this lawsuit about?

Lisa (28:42.249)

So the suit was filed by Antoine Fahim Tolbert. He filed a federal lawsuit against the city of Cleveland and a Cleveland police detective claiming malicious prosecution and a violation of his First and Second Amendment rights. Now, this is in connection with August 2024 incidents in the Lee Harvard neighborhood. Tolbert is a member of an armed neighborhood patrol group called New Era Cleveland.

There was a disagreement apparently with a gas station employee that led to new era members boycotting the gas station. Tolbert was arrested when the station owner claimed that Tolbert demanded protection money. Tolbert and two others were acquitted by a jury, but prosecutor Michael Malley has appealed. he says the jury instructions unfairly benefited Tolbert. the decision on that appeal is to be determined. But the suit alleges that Cleveland

Detective Timothy Hannon knew there was no case here, but he tried to convict because of Tolbert’s criticism of the Cleveland Police Department. They also say he failed to maintain surveillance footage that would have exonerated Tolbert and ignored conflicting wit witness testimony.

Leila (29:54.291)

So we we hear often that grand juries would indict a ham sandwich, right? They would they would indict almost anything prosecutors put in front of them, but that is not the same thing as convincing jurors beyond a reasonable doubt. And this case really does remind us that an indictment is just the beginning of the process. It’s not proof that someone actually committed a crime. Are prosecutors becoming too aggressive here?

Or are juries becoming more skeptical? When you see a case involving this this many serious charges and in a complete acquittal, what does it tell you? Is it that prosecutors are bringing weaker cases or that juries are demanding more proof than they once did? What do you what do you think? What do you make of this whole thing?

Lisa (30:34.121)

Well, I I’m not sure that they what they did with the station owner’s allegations about protection money. I you know, I I I don’t have enough details on the case, but but for O’Malley to say that the jury instructions benefited Tolbert unfairly, I I I feel like there’s some holes here that I I need to know more about.

Leila (30:40.562)

Mm.

Leila (30:53.106)

Well, we will follow and see what what comes of this. You’re listening to today in Ohio. Let’s do one more. East Cleveland’s mayor says people have gotten the wrong impression about her city’s police department. Courtney, what rumors is she trying to put to rest?

Courtney (31:07.542)

So there was this Facebook post among these online rumors that like kind of blew up recently. And this Facebook post said that the city had only three or four police officers working. And Mayor Sandra Morgan says this is not true. Do not believe this. She said there are 16 East Cleveland cops currently, and there’s three to four working per shift. Now, this is still a small department, and Morgan said the city would like to have twenty-four to thirty officers as is budgeted for.

But you know, at this point, she’s saying, like, don’t believe what you’re reading online. Now, granted, there are two cops who are on medical leave, and there is one official we’re not really sure the est the status of. He’s been accused of of some sexual misconduct. So there’s a question mark on that staffer. But, you know, on the other hand, the Cuyoga County Sheriff’s Department is helping out in East Cleveland on the weekends only.

Lisa (31:54.487)

So there’s a question I’ll ask offer. But, you know, on the other hand, Kyle we can’t probably see a sheriff’s department how

Courtney (32:04.93)

And then there’s also the Ohio State Highway Patrol kind of supplementing the small department. There’s also officers who are working overtime out there to cover the needs. But writ large, the mayor says we we have way more than three or four folks on staff at the moment.

Leila (32:22.13)

So th the mayor says this isn’t true, but thousands of people believed it almost immediately. It’s like the city’s reputation is so entrenched that people accept almost any bad news without questioning it. The rumor spreads so quickly because so many people just found it believable. Every administration inherits decades of headlines about corruption and financial problems and policing scandals, but can anything restore the public trust in East Cleveland or or d or

Courtney, do you think some institutions just reach a point where people simply stop giving them the benefit of the doubt when they see stuff like this online?

Courtney (32:55.596)

You know, Mayor Morgan has a point here and she acknowledges exactly what you’re saying, Layla. She’s saying, you know, we have not been as a city very communicative. I’m trying to undo that and and give us a new relationship with our residents where they can trust the information coming out of City Hall. So, you know, whether those efforts are successful, we’ll have to see. But thank goodness there’s a mayor in there who’s mindful of that now and trying to be responsive to the residents by

You know, addressing these things in a city hall that has not always been open.

Leila (33:31.346)

Thank you. That’s all the time we have for our Friday episode. Thank you all for joining us this week. It’s been a pleasure hosting. Please join us Monday when Chris Quinn is back behind the mic.